GGTharos, let us talk Yugoslavia!

All right! How can you talk about Yugoslavian MiG-s when you know that to begin with, Yugoslavians were outnumbered 10 to 1!!!!!!

Are you politician or something? Why didn't you bring the fact that NATO agresion on Yugoslavia was a classic example of STATE SPONSORED terrorist act against Yugoslavia?

Go check FBI web site, read the definition of the word TERRORISM, and then come back to talk about F-15's and MiG-29's over Yugoslavia, would you please????!!!!

Oh, you brought it here, good.

If you cannot discern the point of the thread, kindly shut up and quit with your policising.

The whole point was to refute claims that AMRAAMs are easy to dodge when picked up on RWR. It realy doesn't matter who the MiGs belonged to, and I quite frankly don't give a flying you know what about the NATO air campaign or Yugoslavia.

That is it, end of discussion insofar as I'm concerned. Go whine about getting bombed to someone else.

If you cannot discern the point of the thread, kindly shut up and quit with your policising.

Indeed, it is not very obvious why did you take F-15 terrorist activities over Yugoslavia to make your point, or show yor knowledge about AMRAM's and Russian RWR's? Why did you take Yugoslavia as an example? Yugoslavia was outnumbered 10 to 1 in number of airplanes! How can you have any inteligent conclusion about the technologies, when the war was mostly about numbers! Put 10 latest F-15 against 1 MiG-29, and no problems!

That is it, end of discussion insofar as I'm concerned. Go whine about getting bombed to someone else.

The end of discussion will be when you and those like you understand that NATO undertook the most shamefull terrorist action in its history by UNLAWFULLY attacking Yugoslavia! By definition, NATO action was an act of terrorism, STATE SPONSORED TERRORISM!

NATO bombs killed three years old Milica Rakic, while she was at her home, sitting on her potty! She is now saint! Are you proud of that as well?

It is very obvious. Two F-15s, two MiGs, testimonies from the shot down pilots which describe a point of interest.

If you can't understand that, I'm sorry for you.

End of discussion.

It is very obvious. Two F-15s, two MiGs, testimonies from the shot down pilots which describe a point of interest.

Ohh, my … This is pathetic! How old are you? Do you really believe there was only two F-15’s in the air? If so, why did NATO bring 4 AWACS, dozens of F-16’s, dozen or so F-18’s total of almost 1200 aircraft?! You still do not realize that NATO had 10 times more aircraft in the theatre then Serbia!

If you can't understand that, I'm sorry for you.

What you do not understand is that your government committed an act of state sponsored terrorism over Yugoslavia! End of discussion!

Which part of the engagement did you not understand? There were no other aircraft engaging those Migs. It was a 2v2 engagement. So what if there were more aircraft flying around? They weren't involved.

... and which government would that be, by the way? ;) I don't live in the USA.

What you fail to understand is that I don't care about Yugoslavia; I'm just interested in missile performance, and that's it. You can go ahead and scream about Yugoslavia all you want: It means nothing to me, and is not a part of any discussion I wish to have. Unless you have a point to make that is relevant to the information I am trying to gather, please don't ever attemp to hijack any of my threads again. My interest is purely technical, and have no desire whatsoever to discuss the politics behind the war, or wether it was wrong or right. I'm not going to join your flag-waiving, and I'm not going to side with you.

А,слабо по-русски написать?

Народ кто бачит по аглицки объясни не ведающему югославу .

Про то что АИМ-120 имеют АРГСН что Ф-15Ц имеет РЭБ что его РЛС мощнее чем у МиГ-29, что Р-27Р1 во первых имеют ухудшенную ГСН относительно Р-27Р у которой и так ГСН не есть идеал. Что МиГ 29А не имеет РЭБ, что он имеет преимущества только в БВБ а в ДВБ проигрывает Ф-15Ц и Е сильно. И в конце концов то что это самолёты разных классов.

2 GGTharos

I completely agree you idea.

Which part of the engagement did you not understand? There were no other aircraft engaging those Migs. It was a 2v2 engagement. So what if there were more aircraft flying around? They weren't involved.

How do you know they were not arround? How come Yugoslavina radars could not spot and track F-15's, and guide Yugoslavian MiG's in the best possilbe position to shoot?

... and which government would that be, by the way? ;) I don't live in the USA.

UK, Belgium, Holand, all of those governemnts that were involved! By definition, they commited an act of state sponsored terrorism over Yugoslavia!

What you fail to understand is that I don't care about Yugoslavia; I'm just interested in missile performance, and that's it.

That is a bunch of balllooooonies! If you are interested in missile performance you would not take Yugoslavia as an example! Simply because Yugoslavian airforce was outnumbered. And NATO airplanes could always be positoined to take the best and most favorable misile launch! What does that tell you about missile performance? It tells you that if you take an easy shot, it works! So is that what you are after?

You can go ahead and scream about Yugoslavia all you want: It means nothing to me, and is not a part of any discussion I wish to have. Unless you have a point to make that is relevant to the information I am trying to gather, please don't ever attemp to hijack any of my threads again.

PLEASE don't be rude! You got it! I am not hijacking anybody's threads! You started a discussion about the war in Yugoslavia! You DID NOT MENTION that yugoslavian airforce was outnumbered 10 to 1! NATO fighter airplanes did not engage unless the kill was guaranteed without a loss! NATO used quantity and to some extent technology to attack and kill without the loss!

My interest is purely technical, and have no desire whatsoever to discuss the politics behind the war, or wether it was wrong or right. I'm not going to join your flag-waiving, and I'm not going to side with you.

I am more then happy that people like you DO NOT side with me! You can not talk technical issues without mentionig all relevant information! Please go back to that thread and tell pepople that Yugoslavian airforce was outnumbered 10 to 1, that NATO flew AWACS over forign countries so the yugoslavia could not attack them, that in 22 000 sorties, NATO destroyed 15 tanks and armoured vehicles, and only after that we can talk about how effective is AMRAAM and RWR's!

END OF DISCUSSION!

I shall try itself to translate.

1st.

MiG-29 And F-15 it is fighters of different classes

2st.

If to be objective that MiG-29 has a radar less strong than radar F-15 on range of detection target.

3.

MiG-29А Which was at the Yugoslavian Air Forces had not the newest weapon AA, R-27R1 there is export variant R-27R, at R1 worsened characteristics ГСН (the Head Itself Promptings = ГСН) be relative R-27R, itself R-27R not new too.

4.

F-15C Has ECM that makes his difficult target for the Radar, and R-27R and R1 have no HOJ (if I am not mistaken) and use ECM is spoilt strongly with characteristics R-27R1

5. MiG-29A has no ECM.

6. F-15 there is AMRAAM, and this already new generation AAM

7. MiG-29 has plus in close combat, his optical locator, and R-73 helmut guided, that in a combination in a good maneuverability gives plus in close combat and latent combat (RWR is not signalising of detection enemy a radar). But as I understand presence AWACS has not given to take advantage bonus MiG-29 such as latent combat.

I like MiG-29, and I hate NATO, but I should recognize that distant comabt F-15C will more probably win.

Sorry...

I like MiG-29, and I hate NATO, but I should recognize that distant comabt F-15C will more probably win.

 

Sorry...

I fully understand that modern F-15 with latest AMRAAM will win against the old MiG-29 with outdated R-27R missile! And I agree with you on this 100%!

For that reason, one can not use the Yugoslavian F-15, MiG-29 engagement as an example on how good AMRAAM is, or is it possible for MiG-29 to dodge the AMRAAM! Keep in mind, NATO had many more airplanes than just two F-15's in the air as well!

At good combat training even MiG-21 can escape from one AMRAAM, can use maneuvers which will spend speed/fuel AIM-120С. But when you escape from AIM-120, you probably cannot continue combat, your radar does not look at the enemy.

At newer Soviet planes pluss have appeared, rockets R-27ET have appeared, R-27ER (with HOJ), have established ECM, that gives some balance R-27ER has the big range of flight, big than AIM-120, that will force the enemy to start to maneuver. And it is possible even to turn from you a radar.

But also here not all is simple.

About this combat MiG-29 vs F-15 above Yugoslavia I know a little, I shall not make comments therefore.

y

Interesing what CNN can do :)

I can not believe GGTharos that you believe that there were just 2 F15 lol

баннер всетаки маловат..... пивных дел масера можно и поболе изобразить :)

ага, а вообще и за это надо пистон вставить за совращение великовозрастных впрпилов к употреблению алкогольной продукции.

Понимаешь рекламируют своё пыво палёное сербское.

VENI, VIDI... closed it.